Interview Transcript

Mike Destefano

ENGL 210

Ms. Rodwell

Due 9/29/2025

My informant has given verbal consent to being recorded and interviewed.

MIKE: Alright, we’re going to put this over here. Alright, so take two. I’m going to ask for your verbal consent for being recorded and consent is given. Alright, great. Let’s start with our first questionnaire. We have around a dozen questions. Some are shorter than others and some are a little longer. Feel free to be open and, you know, Um, feel free to give your honest answer, you know? Um, yeah. So, our first question is gonna be, of course, why did you agree to this interview? Um, I believe you know what the interview is about. Um, I’ll repeat, which is, uh, it’s about the U.S. incarceration system and, uh, perspectives on it. So, yeah, just, uh, give me a rundown on, you know.

CHARLIE: Um, well, I saw your Instagram story talking about how you were looking for someone to answer questions about, like, the incarceration system, and I’ve, like, read a lot of papers on this, so I, like, have a lot of opinions on the system and how it can be improved and how it’s unfair for some people. So I have a lot to say about it, but that’s why I responded. 

MIKE: Yeah, the opinions can be vast because this is all about opinions, this whole thing. So, sorry, my hair’s like everywhere. Let’s go with our second question. We’ll start with something maybe a little personal, so… um take it as you may um not about it but uh do you know do you personally know someone who has been incarcerated or maybe a friend that has someone that has been incarcerated?

CHARLIE: Thankfully no I don’t know anyone personally who has been arrested or served time i don’t roll around with people who do so no

MIKE: Okay fair enough um okay that knocks that question off um Uh, I will ask your political background and, um, I’ll ask a follow up about that in just a second, but yeah, what’s your, you know, political background? Um, where do you stand on that?

CHARLIE: Um, I like to tell people I’m like independent because you never know, like just never know who you can trust. But like, I see both sides, like there’s some policies I agree on with like the Trump administration and there’s some policies I agree on with the Harris administration. But in the last election, I did vote for Kamala, so. 

MIKE: Okay. Cool. My follow-up would be, do you think it plays a part in how you or maybe other people think about the incarceration system? 

CHARLIE: No, not necessarily. It’s just more of, like, your, like, background as a person, like, more of like your skin color that’s more of a play than what your political beliefs are as to why you get incarcerated.

MIKE: Okay well we will address um racial inequality later on in the question so you have a lot of time to you know express your opinions on that so um let’s start with the overview do you consider yourself a big supporter of the current incarceration system as is?

CHARLIE: No, not at all. I just, I feel like it can be very much improved, and it’s just, it’s unfair to a lot of people and a lot of minorities. And, like, I don’t want to, like, bring, like, race into this, but, like, it really has to do with race. It’s just not fair to the different races, to the different racisms, or to the different races when it comes to incarceration.

MIKE: Okay. Yeah. Okay. This is a little extension. Do you think everyone in prison is treated equally? 

CHARLIE: No, 100%. No, not at all. 

MIKE:Why do you think that is? Do you think it has to do with financial status? Do you think it has to do with race? It has to do with financial status. 

CHARLIE: It has to do with race, especially financial status, actually. Because, yeah, let’s say a white man gets arrested and he gets on bail. If he’s earning $500,000 a year, his bail will be like $10,000, and they’ll let him out. But if a black man was arrested and was given bail… he would only be earning $10,000 a year, and his bail would be like $50,000, which just, it’s not, even though the same, they committed the same exact crime, it’s just not fair to people of color. 

MIKE: All right, our sixth question, we’re already almost halfway through, making moves. A lot of people do believe that incarcerated individuals deserve the harsh conditions that often come with prison life. Do you think that the harsh conditions are natural, and do you think that it’s fair? That’s a two-part question. 

CHARLIE: Well, honestly, for me, it depends on what you did. Like, for instance, let’s just use the Idaho murderer guy, Brian. He deserves everything that’s going on for him in prison right now. Like, he deserves to be tortured. Like, he literally killed people.

MIKE: Can you say that name one more time? for his crime it’s funny i don’t hear about that much in the media really yeah we’ll have to address that later on there’s another question about that which yeah so that’s that’s a good uh that’s a good point you’re bringing up so um yeah tell me more about it 

CHARLIE: Um i mean i don’t really like watch the case all i know is that he murdered four people and he’s like serving like conservative lives now and apparently he’s not being treated right in prison and that’s that’s a hundred percent okay because you literally murdered four people who hadn’t like they didn’t know who you were you came and killed them in cold blood you deserve every bad thing that’s coming towards you but let’s say for instance like someone accidentally hit someone with their car and they ended up dying and it was like an accident and the person has to serve jail time I feel like if it was an accident, they shouldn’t be treated harshly because it was just an honest mistake and like accidents happen. Yeah. 

MIKE: Um, all right, let’s go with our next question. Number seven. Um, I guess this is kind of an extension of, do you believe in a kind of, um, punishment that mirrors the crime? Yeah, let’s start on that part. It’s a two-part question, I guess. So we’ll start on that first part. 

CHARLIE: So I believe that if a guy rapes a woman, he should get raped as well. I feel like they should give him a transgender surgery just so he can get raped as well, just so he can experience what he put that person through. Because that’s just what I believe.

MIKE: Fair enough. Now, the second part of this question, do you see any chance of rehabilitation for these people that you know may commit like these serious crimes such as you know rape murder etc or even for more lesser crimes like assault, or robbery?

CHARLIE: Um, robbery i could see like changes i feel like it depends on what the person’s like background life looked like because you know like some cities in like chicago most people like running gangs and stuff and so if they’re like committing crimes it’s because of how they were like raised and the people they like ran around with but i do believe that if they serve some time and you know get the help that they need they can make a change for the better because actually now that i do think about it one of my friend’s dad when he was younger he did end up going to jail because he was caught for a robbery and it changed him because now he he has a business he’s rich he lives in new hampshire and he’s doing well yeah because he changed it’s just because of the people he was running with when he was younger yeah 

MIKE: So, so would you say that the impact yeah okay that’s a it’s funny when you talk about these things it kind of like opens up like past things you know yeah um yeah that’s uh um yeah number eight um now we’re going into you know the current president uh trump you know he uh he has pushed, he seems to be pushing for harsher criminal justice policies, including broader use of death penalty. I just want to see what your stance is on that. Do you like the idea?

CHARLIE: I do believe that the death penalty should be used in certain circumstances. Like, for instance, the Luigi Mangione case, I don’t believe that man deserves the death penalty. 

MIKE: That was a big case, yeah.

CHARLIE: Yeah, it still is, and I’m glad that the death penalty has not been taken off the plate for that issue because he was fighting for something for millions of Americans who couldn’t afford health care, and he was trying to make a statement, and that statement was opened up, and more people are hearing about the statement that he tried to make. But when it comes to someone like the person who did kill Charlie Kirk a couple weeks ago, I do see that the death penalty is on the table for that. And personally, I don’t really like Charlie Kirk, so I do understand where his killer is coming from, but I just don’t think he should have been executed for it. But I also just don’t believe that he also deserves the death penalty for it. this crime, but other people see it. MIKE: Yeah, I don’t know if you saw that video about, you know, the assassination, like, the uncensored brutal. 

CHARLIE: And I just, I feel like the whole thing, honestly, is just being rushed, and there’s just a lot of things they’re not telling the public, which is just, they’re only, like, showing light on the death penalty, and like, oh, they found his weapon, oh, he has this, oh, he came from this background of a family, and it’s just… Yeah. Yeah, you know, there’s a lot of issues with transparency, you know. I feel like just in general, and I guess spinning back to, you know, the system itself, the incarceration system, you know, there’s a lot of things that go on inside prisons that, you know, people don’t really know. 

MIKE: You see some shows, like, you know, I don’t know if you ever watched, like, Beyond Scared Street or 60 Days In. Like, personally, I’ve watched a couple of, you know, episodes of those. And have you ever watched any of those? 

CHARLIE: No, I haven’t. No. 

MIKE: Yeah, I’ll give you a little rundown. 60 days in is a better one for us. Basically, people that have been formerly incarcerated, they go back in and they’re kind of like a spy inside the prison themselves. They kind of, you know, establish themselves as a prisoner for, you know, 60 days. And they, you know, they’re like a spy. You know, they show us what goes on in there, you know, in terms of the culture, the lifestyle, you know. How, you know, discipline is handled up in there. Yeah, shows like that, you know, they really open up things. And it really shows, I feel like, a lack of transparency there sometimes. Would you agree with me on that?

CHARLIE: Yeah. 

MIKE: Yeah, now we’re kind of extending to media. Do you think the incarceration system and its flaws and whatnot, do you think it’s discussed enough by the media? Do you think it’s talked about by the media at all, really? 

CHARLIE: No, no, it’s not talked about by the media at all. And there are some celebrities, like I will say this, Kim Kardashian has done an okay job trying to put more light on… The system, because in a couple of her episodes, like their TV show, she has visited a lot of jails and talked with a lot of prisoners. And their show is watched by millions. And so them using their show to bring more light onto the system, I feel like it’s a really powerful thing that she’s trying to do. And I actually commend her for that. And I just feel like more celebrities should do the same thing because CNN isn’t going to do it. Fox News is not going to do it. So if you have a big platform like the Kardashians do, they should use that platform. 

MIKE: A little follow-up, I guess. I just kind of popped this off time ahead. Why do you think these news agencies with these big followings, you know, maybe not as big as Kim, or maybe bigger than Kim, I don’t really know. But the point is, they do have a pretty big following. You know, a lot of people, millions of people tune in to watch the, you know, CNN and Fox News every day, but yet, they don’t report about that. Why do you think that is? 

CHARLIE: Because the government pays them. It’s just, here’s a check. If you just don’t say this, we’ll pay you. And their banks are full and their mouths are shut. Because when it all comes down to money, if someone offers a million dollars here to not say anything, they’re obviously going to take it because it’s just, it’s greed. Yeah. 

MIKE: Next question. Okay. Yeah, this is going to extend to the media as well. Are there any shows or news stories or personal accounts that you’ve seen or read that have shaped your perspective on what you think about the incarceration system right now? 

CHARLIE: Not really. Honestly, the last thing I ever saw about the news on the system was about the Mendez brothers and when they got denied bail. And then other than that was Gypsy Rose getting out. And that was like, what, a year and a half ago? Yeah. So that’s pretty much it. Yeah. 

MIKE: So it seems like news agencies cover like the big names. Yeah. They don’t really. Yeah. That’s an interesting thing for sure. Somebody should do some research on that. How do you think media and TV shows, when they do talk about things like that, how do you think it influences public opinion about the prison system? Do you think they’re really as accurate as they portray it to be? 

CHARLIE: No, I really don’t think it is. They’re telling us what they’re told to say to the public. They’re getting second-hand information that they’re required to give to the public, and it’s just not something that can influence people in a way. Do you kind of get what I’m trying to say? MIKE: Yeah. I understand that. We have a couple more questions here. You know, what’s something you wish more people understood about the incarceration system in the U.S.? 

CHARLIE: That it’s very unfair. Like, it’s just not fair to everyone. And it should be, everyone should be treated equally when it comes to getting arrested and serving time. And being charged, you know, accordingly.

MIKE: And do you think there’s hope for a better incarceration system as we grow older? You and I are both pretty young.

CHARLIE: We’re not in our 30s yet, but we’re going to get there pretty soon. I always say we just have to wait. Hold on. We have to wait for everyone, the class of what? The class of 1980s to die. Once they die, it’s us. It’s us who are coming up. It’s our time. Yeah, it’s our time pretty much. So we just gotta wait for all of them to die and we’re good. 

MIKE: Why do you say that? I just want to get an idea on that. 

CHARLIE: I feel like because everyone who’s in their 30s or younger right now are pretty much… We’re, I don’t want to say woke, but we are woke. We understand more than people who are in their 60s and 70s and 80s understand. Because right now, those people are still stuck in the time period of the 1960s, even though we’re in the big age of 2025. And so no change is going to happen because they’re all still stuck on the past and they’re still trying to do things the way they did in the 1960s and 1950s. And that is why we just need to wait for them to die so we can go in there and make the change and it’s a change. 

MIKE: I think I want to wrap around a couple of questions from the beginning just to get some more information about them. Let’s see if there’s any good ones. I feel like I want to talk about more about the inequality. You know, I feel like it’s a very important thing that, you know, I want to discuss further. If there’s any, you know, maybe, you know, talk about, like, maybe their status or, you know, there’s celebrities that, you know, do get, you know, I know there’s, like, OJ Simpson. That’s, like, an old one, but… 

CHARLIE: Oh, that case was insane. Yeah, you know… 

MIKE: Yeah. Yeah, let’s see, what other ones, you know. I mean, Luigi Mangione, I mean, he got a lot of fame from Twitter. Yeah, he does have a lot of… 

CHARLIE: And also, his background is he comes from a rich family, he has money. Yeah. Which is, I mean, understandable. But also, I feel like the crime he did isn’t something… isn’t that big. Like, it’s just a normal shooting. But the way, like, the media portrayed it, it’s like, this man killed the president of the United States. He really did not. He shot a CEO that’s a regular person. And not only that, but as soon as he shot the CEO and the CEO had died, they replaced the CEO within 24 hours. So I just… Yeah. It’s just a normal shooting, I fear. Yeah. Um… Yeah. They’ll give him the death penalty for killing one person, but a school shooter gets 12 conservative life sentences and not the death penalty, which just doesn’t make any sense. Even though the school shooter shot like 20 people and killed 20 people. 

MIKE:  Actually, I do have an extra question now. Do you think that people that commit more violent crimes deserve the death penalty? Actually, where do you think the death penalty should apply?

CHARLIE: Um.. for things like rape and child pornography you deserve jail time but then also you are going to be getting uh surgery to change your logical you’re going to be changing to the different genders that you can get raped as well

MIKE:  um what about like child pornography stuff like that anything that should lie in a ideal um system in your opinion 

CHARLIE: um child pornography depends i wouldn’t say death penalty but if it’s like child sexual assault or like child rape death penalty but like child pornography lock him up for life let him live it out and just die it’s interesting because you know with those kind of people that commit crimes against children you know they get where your idea on that would come from like to let them let them go to prison and let them suffer in prison yeah let them get killed by somebody else yeah or whatever may happen to them 

MIKE: yeah um so i guess you would be if i’m correct like a supporter of like like you know you remember the the term eye for eye yeah would you would you say you’re a supporter of that kind of theory

CHARLIE: yeah

MIKE: fair enough um cool um let’s see, sometimes we hear reports you know from what we do here you know like over rikers island and new york there’s a lot of overcrowding issues in that certain um certain prison 

CHARLIE: And also I feel like it’s more of the money that’s supposed to be going to the prison is not making it to the prison, and that’s just not right. And people need to start investigating more as to why this money isn’t going to the prison. Why do they live in these harsh conditions? Even if, like, let’s say the prison is getting a $1 million check, where is that money going to? If it’s not making at least the prison conditions livable, where is this money going to? Yeah. And that’s why… No, no. Yeah, no, like, that’s just, like, I feel like it needs to be, like, investigated. Where’s the money to expand the building? Where did that money go? If it’s not being used to, like, improve the prison, where is it going to? Is someone taking it? Is someone buying a new car with it? 

MIKE: What about, you know, those people that, you know, do suffer from mental health issues you know that get put into these kind of prisons that are you know rough that don’t that don’t help that don’t help their mental health you know it only you know messes them up worse 

CHARLIE: did you know actually um if you have a mental illness and you get charged with a crime and you do get sent to prison you don’t get like the drugs to help you like your um medication you don’t I interned at a law firm, and it was a case with this one guy who got caught for something. He pled it out instead so he didn’t have to go to jail, but if he had gone to jail, the jail would not have provided him with the medication to keep him sane, and that’s just not right at all because if you go to prison and you’re not taking the medication that helps you act normally, you’re going to start acting out. You’re probably going to end up hurting yourself, hurting others, adding more time to yourself, and that’s just not right at all. so it’s like a spiral at that point.

MIKE: um i think i want to go back a little bit into you know the president himself you know his ideas um Do you think it might have been different if Kamala won the election? 

CHARLIE: Oh, yeah, 100%. Actually, if Kamala won the election, I don’t think Charlie Kirk would have been dead.

MIKE: Really?

CHARLIE: I really do believe that. 

MIKE: Okay. Can you give me some more details on that? 

CHARLIE:  I mean, we know that the shooter shot Charlie Kirk because of, like, the stuff he was saying and the stuff that he believed. But all that stuff that Charlie Kirk was saying was only fueled by the Trump administration because he was under Trump. He was basically Trump’s right-hand wingman. But if Kamala Harris had won, Charlie Kirk would have been nowhere near the White House at all. So he would have just been, like, the normal podcaster everyone, like, posted on TikTok here and there. And I just feel like if Kamala had won… Kirk will probably still be here. 

MIKE: You know, yeah, he definitely… It took me surprise by that one, because, you know, a lot of people didn’t agree with what he said, but at the same time, the brutal execution was, you know… It was insane, yeah.

CHARLIE:  It’s terrible regardless of, you know, who you support and whatnot. But I feel like if Kamala was in office right now, she’d be fighting for everyone’s needs and… maybe the so-and-so shooter would not have had to go and shoot Charlie Kirk because he would have had Kamala Harris fighting for his needs. 

MIKE: Where do you think his future lies in the incarceration system? Because a lot of people in prison could side with him for killing Kirk because… People in prison are siding with Luigi for shooting the CEO. People are siding with him. 

CHARLIE: Prisoners tend to take sides, and seeing from Luigi, people are on his side, I low-key feel people are going to be on his side, Kirk’s killer side in prison. But we’ll see. Yeah, we’ll see. MIKE: Do you think maybe some states are better about incarceration systems? You know, Um, because I know there’s, there’s, um, there’s private jails that, um, you know, there’s, you know, there’s like town, the county jails and stuff like that. 

CHARLIE: Yeah, actually, whatchamacallit, have you seen, uh, those people, I don’t know their names, but… They recently just got, well, they got pardoned by Donald Trump. There were, like, two TV stars that evaded tax, committed tax evasion. I remember when he came out of prison, the husband was talking about how he enjoyed it, but, like, he said that it was really harsh for, like, people of color in that prison. And that is another thing, is that being a celebrity, he did use his voice to talk about the system and how it wasn’t fair for people inside. And that’s someone I like to commend for having the courage to speak up about that. But, yeah. 

MIKE: So I guess another question I would have is, do you think it would take people to speak out rather than relying on news agencies to actually say anything? 

CHARLIE: Yeah, I feel like we just need to start putting some of these more celebrities in prison just because they’re speaking out about it. 

MIKE: That’s funny. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, I mean, we’ll see what happens, honestly. Yeah, I feel like we’ve answered, like, everything here. Let’s see. I mean, I guess is there anything else you want to say? Like, anything that’s still lingering on your mind, you know? Any other opinions?

CHARLIE: No, but this was fun, I lowkey enjoy interviews.. Well conversations like these

MIKE: Yes, but I guess that sums up the interview. Once again, thank you. I appreciate your time.